Where, when, and why did the New Age originate?

Huge questions.

If you can answer those questions, then you can answer the basic premise and question that every ex-Ramster (moi included, of course) ends up asking themselves at least 20 times a day.

"HOW did I do it? HOW did I get involved with something so blatantly stupid??!!"

You know it.....I know it. We ALL know it.

Well, I'm a mind that has learned that tracing a thing back to it's source will give one many answers to many questions along the way. That sound reasonable?

Along those lines, let's examine some of the roots of this contemporary phenomenon we've learned to call, "The New Age".

Firstly, I will tell you some things you may not want to hear, but are true none-the-less. People who have known me for years on the Internet know that I don't provide sources, I simply pass on what I've learned. I've no time nor inclination to be a librarian...I'm a writer...you may do the research yourself, since with a little intelligent effort it is quite easily and readily available now on the Internet (thank the DoD!). Don't be surprised, however, when you find the authors of such information, or the one's who investigated these premises to begin with, to be people that perhaps you or your friends have learned to demonize like religion. That also is part of the process...

(....ahem)

Russian people are not stupid. They are victimized to their very souls, ...but they are not stupid. They realized shortly after World War Two that there was no way that their communist system could beat our capitalist one on even ground or terms. So the obvious alternative was to cheat. In governmental terms, this means espionage (to try and stay even in technology), and subversion.

Now...subversion (for some reason this is not taught in schools) can take several forms. The classic forms are, in order of severity and likely chaotic outcomes: 1) assassination 2) terrorism 3) inciting revolts 4) political hijacking of offices.

Obviously I am omitting the all too apparent propaganda that we've all learned to live with thanks to Dan Rather and his like. ;-)

Of these various methods of subversion, assassination is the least regarded, and for obvious reasons. It's a cowboy action born from desperation. Desperation like that can only occur from two foundations. Either you miscalculated so badly that you must take out the personal threat, or you are retaliating from an assault.

Terrorism is also frowned upon in intelligent circles, and for the simple reason that it rarely does anything other than elicit a short-termed emotional response from the recipient, does little to nothing to disrupt baseline social factors like economy, birthrates, education levels, imports, exports, etc. and nearly always induces a retaliatory response. It backfires on the author in other words. This is why Islamic radicals are so stupid. LOL!!!

Inciting revolts: Ahhhhh, finally something we can dig our teeth into! Inciting revolts can be anything from a simple protest march, to demonstrations that block access to, to self-immolations by morons who don't realize that they are only setting themselves on fire and committing suicide when the war is already over... (LOL!!) Inciting revolts can take many forms,....and has. It is the most preferred method of "messing around with" your opponent on the global stage (at least during the Cold War era) since it provided the most bang for the buck. The Soviets were mightily impressed by the power of their hippies during the 1960's. A little too impressed, methinks.

It's well established, proved, and known to those not sufferring from Terminal Historical Denial Syndrome that most of the so-called "Democrat Party inspired" protest movements during Vietnam were originated in thought, conception, and organization from the Kremlin, and in some cases, Peking. Malcom X, the SDS, and the rest of the rabble rousers or that era, (many of whom hold office (D)...today) were financed, organized, etc., etc. by actual KGB and Chinese agents. (see Venona Project, etc.) Obviously, this would be a natural and logical thing for the Chinese and Soviets to do, since they opposed us in that war and had such easy access to our campuses, etc., etc. This practice continues to this day, although not by the Russians, and has been photographed and videotaped on many, many occassions. Search Youtube for examples. The truth regarding Vietnam is that the "official" Democrat Party totally supported the war. Over 45,000 American men died during Johnson's administration alone. One reason that they were protested at the DNC in Chicago (for those that recall that era accurately).

The basic strategy of these nations (China and the old Soviet Union) was this. We cannot compete with the American economy on even ground. Japan and Germany learned the hard way how that worked. Therefore, in order to compete while industrialization is attempted, the American economy and political process must be "slowed down". This can be done by creating "non-issues" that force the political will and public finance in directions that ARE NOT competitive or damaging to the Chinese, Russians, et al. It's called "distraction" in common vernacular.

Now this was been done to great effect to the United States during the entire 1960-1970 timeframe. The Kremlin basically dictated, through organized protest movements of some of the most un-qualified members of our society at the time, (it wasn't as if scientists and housewives were marching in those streets....let's get real here) how America could actually lose a war they wanted us to lose, even though we enjoyed vastly superior firepower on the ground. That is a lesson that is never taught in American schools.

Anyone who has ever researched the "Venona Project" already knows who the author of the American civil rights movement was. The Kremlin again. The evidence speaks for itself and has been available to the general public for years now...like ten of them at least. The goal of the Kremlin in creating the American civil rights movement....or rather, fanning the movement that already existed, was single in it's scope. It had no intention of preventing blacks from voting...that movement was already well underway in America on it's own. They had nothing to do with the womens suffrage movement of the 1930's...although some will argue that fact. For the communists it all boiled down to literacy tests. If the Kremlin could somehow manage the abolition of literacy tests as a requirement to vote, ...then their propaganda efforts would obviously be strengthed...and by expotential proportions.

As we all know...this was accomplished in the 1960's and now any brain-dead-fool in the country has a say-so in how the most powerful nation in the history of the human race...is run.

Sound intelligent to you? Sound like what the Founding Fathers had in mind to you? (LOL....)

Yet this is EXACTLY the situation we find ourselves in today. Ignorance is rewarded...and at all levels of this society. You can be dumb as the proverbial stump, spend your entire day drunk as a skunk, walking around your driveway in blinders and bumping into the garage door...but the government will STILL support you. AND YOU GET TO VOTE!!! ...It's true and you know it.

You want to talk about "conspiracy theories"??? LMAO!!!

I could elaborate with example after example after example until the sun rose, set, and rose again...but I think you understand me (and if you don't you have the Internet to aid you). The uneducated and "not-knowing" have become empowered in our society. Our own entertainment industry reflects this absurdity, to be sure.

But why beat a dead horse?

The point is that THESE SORTS OF SOCIAL MOVEMENTS equate to an overall mentality, or lack of it, that can now begin to pay attention to, investigate, spend a whole hell of a lot of time with, and in some cases, even accept.....the totally absurd and unfounded. Like the "New Age" and all the hocus-pocus that has accompanied it. Like channeling...

THIS is why "our age" will be known by historians of the future as the Age Of Ridiculousness. (LOL!!! I'm being metaphorical here...)

Once you begin to value "feeling" over "thought", then social fabric is weakened by any measure, for the simple reason that feeling has rarely turned out to be rational...at least according to history, that is.

Once a society has accepted ignorance as it's standard, worships ego and the transitory emotional state of any one particular individual (another narcisstic tendency) then the space now exists for ridiculous thought to enter and animate. Thus...I give you the New Age and RSE!!!

Yes, here in the New Age...anyone who says so can read your future...all humans are really divinely empowered God's that can't find their keys or wallet but can still wish you dead...you are the re-incarnation of several historical personages who coincidentally have a personal interest to you and the only historical personages that you paid attention to in movies or books...you can do things in dreams that are dream-like, find no evidence of them in the real world, but "believe" that they are real anyway!!! (real in Dimension #435 that is...) You will never die, (such a nasty thought, you know...everyone else does...but not you) and will heal yourself and all the people of the world (well, the ones you choose that is...) once YOU have attained that level of "Mastery" that ET's (including Scamtha) will teach you... Yes, in the New Age "aliens" expend more energy than the human race has ever used, ...in it's entire history, why just to come here and get you, ...or talk to you...or let you get a glimpse of them. That's right!!! Some of them have even arranged interviews that are seen on ABC (Alien Broadcasting Company) around the galaxy, all featuring YOU!!!! Why you're a Galactic Celebrity!!! A star!!! Aren't you just so special...


Then there are the Biblical re-incarnations. While the New Age gives you carte blanche to reject Christianity, isn't it amazing how many of these "Christ's" you meet here that are all the re-incarnation of some personage from the traditional Biblical-Historical cast? When I first delved deeply (lol...you read: moved up here to Ramsterland) into the "Ranch Dressing" (where you dip fried chicken...you know...) within four weeks I had met 12 Cleopatra's, 11 Charlemagne's, 10 Joan of Arcs, 9 Leonardo's, 8 Saint Germain's, 7 Rasputin's, 6 Jesus', FIVE MAG-DA-LENE'S, ...4 Saint John's, 3 Brother James, 2 Mother Mary's, and a Blonde-freak-out-of-her-tree!!!

The absurdity IS comedic... It is.

Now for the "why" this could have occurred in what WAS a society some called "The Greatest Generation".

The answer is simple and has been talked about at length before. There is a huge spiritual void in our Western culture today. Voids get filled where gravity exists....it's a Law of the Universe.

All Western nations suffer from this. Why do they suffer? Because the Christian churches and religions have left them empty and have NOT been supported by the scholarship available in modern fields such as archaeology, linguistics, etc. etc. Finding the Nag Hammadi, the Dead Sea Scrolls, and now the Gospel Of Judas did not bode well for the Christian churches...not to mention the Industrial Revolution and the rise in literacy (since aborted) that it fostered. Hence the void that the "New Age" began to fill. Actually a double void. One of lack of spiritual guidance and one of lack of education (post-1964).

Seek and ye will find, they say. Well, in the Western world, you had a ton of "seekers" shortly after the Industrial Revolution. Simple fact. From this fact we can deduce much.

What was being sought? Well, ...the same old thing. A new spiritual interpretation and format for understanding the everlasting human question, "What is the meaning of Life and why am I in it?"

Human beings are human beings...when a need is there, SOMETHING will come about to try and fill it. Any kid with a teddy bear knows this.

Does that make the "something" real? Because the need is filled...is the teddy bear any more or less real? No, it is not. It's still a teddy bear...it just satisfies emotions, and NOT any practical thought process. The need is still unfilled, as the child will soon learn once he realizes that the teddy bear is only a stuffed construct of fabric and no longer satisfies it's basic need for closeness and friendship. Unless, of course, the child employs delusion.

Thus it is with spirituality and our questions.

And thus it is with how so many have accepted some of the most absurd and unfounded garbage ever spewed on mankind as some sort of psuedo-religion.


Yet...Seekers we remain. For those of us who have turned over the rock that was RSE and looked at the worms crawling in the mud underneath it, replaced the rock, and walked away....well, ...we still seek.

Tyger Tyger, burning bright,
In the forests of the night :
What immortal hand or eye,
Could frame thy fearful symmetry?

In what distant deeps or skies
Burnt the fire of thine eyes?
On what wings dare he aspire?
What the hand dare seize the fire?

And what shoulder, & what art,
Could twist the sinews of thy heart?
And when thy heart began to beat,
What dread hand? & what dread feet?

What the hammer? what the chain,
In what furnace was thy brain?
What the anvil? what dread grasp
Dare its deadly terrors clasp?

When the stars threw down their spears
And water'd heaven with their tears :
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the Lamb make thee?

Tyger, Tyger burning bright
In the forests of the night :
What immortal hand or eye
Dare frame thy fearful symmetry?

Willaim Blake, Songs of Experience

see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tyger#Gnosticism


Tyger,...been following your threads since you appeared. Some good humor, so thanks, but you seemed to have gone edgy here on what shakes and moves 'New Age'. Kremlin??!!!

You stated:
"Human beings are human beings...when a need is there, SOMETHING will come about to try and fill it. Any kid with a teddy bear knows this.

Does that make the "something" real? Because the need is filled...is the teddy bear any more or less real? No, it is not. It's still a teddy bear...it just satisfies emotions, and NOT any practical thought process. The need is still unfilled, as the child will soon learn once he realizes that the teddy bear is only a stuffed construct..."

Is your 'teddy bear' playing fast and loose with the occult or hidden history behind our fates? You say you do not offer sources yet I would ask that you supply them for us.

I know I dug my way out of the same New Age/occult miasma that so many ex-ramsters struggle with here, but I found good sources to stay my confusions and stable my sanity. I like to share those sources when I can...why not Tyger?

have at me then....

btw, I quote Blake because I did an honors course on him in college in 1969--his cranky 'theosophy' and Gnostic temeperment had much to do with my subsequent stridew into New Age through Theosophy and all that 19th century fin de siecle metaphysics...

Joe

Emotions and rational thought...are they so far apart? Just choose the Myth or reality that makes life meaningful for you...and if rational thought is so 'rational', why is there such a wide array of contradictory so called rational thought available to us.
We are human and need to learn how to live with that as best we can. Emotions are part of that...why people get taken in by Gurus, well, lots of possibilities, but I would say that people who are trying to divest themselves of their emotions, hence, their humanity, are more easy pray, than people who are comfortable with the fact that some of their 'thoughts' and feelings just don't make sense...see what I'm saying?

joe sz;

Oh allllllriiiight....but only because you asked so nicely. lol!!!

Here's a few reads for you:

"Venona" by John Earl Haynes and Harvey Klehr.

"Anatomy Of Communist Takeover" by T.T. Hammond (ed.) New Haven (1975)

There is so much other related reference material, that in just going over it cursorily I decided it may be fit for it's own book. Although there are authors who have already done very-well written treatments on the general topic, however, I have learned from bitter experience that only writers on the left side of America are deemed acceptable by this general slice of the society pie...if you catch my meaning. For those reasons I would prefer to share them with you in email or let the readers discover them on their own. They have more legitimacy that way.

"Thrasher"

They were hiding behind hay bales,
They were planting
in the full moon
They had given all they had
for something new
But the light of day was on them,
They could see the thrashers coming
And the water
shone like diamonds in the dew.

And I was just getting up,
hit the road before it's light
Trying to catch an hour on the sun
When I saw
those thrashers rolling by,
Looking more than two lanes wide
I was feelin'
like my day had just begun.

Where the eagle glides ascending
There's an ancient river bending
Down the timeless gorge of changes
Where sleeplessness awaits
I searched out my companions,
Who were lost in crystal canyons
When the aimless blade of science
Slashed the pearly gates.

It was then I knew I'd had enough,
Burned my credit card for fuel
Headed out to where the pavement
turns to sand
With a one-way ticket
to the land of truth
And my suitcase in my hand
How I lost my friends
I still don't understand.

They had the best selection,
They were poisoned with protection
There was nothing that they needed,
Nothing left to find
They were lost in rock formations
Or became park bench mutations
On the sidewalks
and in the stations
They were waiting, waiting.

So I got bored and left them there,
They were just deadweight to me
Better down the road
without that load
Brings back the time
when I was eight or nine
I was watchin' my mama's T.V.,
It was that great
Grand Canyon rescue episode.

Where the vulture glides descending
On an asphalt highway bending
Thru libraries and museums,
galaxies and stars
Down the windy halls of friendship
To the rose clipped by the bullwhip
The motel of lost companions
Waits with heated pool and bar.

But me I'm not stopping there,
Got my own row left to hoe
Just another line
in the field of time
When the thrasher comes,
I'll be stuck in the sun
Like the dinosaurs in shrines
But I'll know the time has come
To give what's mine.

Neil Young & Crazy Horse - Rust Never Sleeps - 1978

In the ancient and most effective art of conspiratorial skulduggery, providing the ignorant with only half truths is the greatest way to ensure victory for ones personal agenda.

The New Age is full of half truths. Religion too. And Ramtha uses it as a form of his teaching.

Give the ignorant all the truth and they will eventually figure it out and the game is over.

Give the ignorant all lies and they will eventually figure it out and the game is over.

Give the ignorant half of the truth and they will hang around and play the game forever looking for the rest of the truth that is hidden within themselves, and because their so busy playing the game they love soooooooo much, they will never ever find the truth that remains hidden in plain site.

I suggest people practice chi qong and the first exercise of the TAO is to learn how to stand.

Do that correctly and you'll understand what cannot be spoken.

Wolfman;

Sweet!! And thank you. I've been getting a ton of heat in here, but I pretty much expected it.

It pretty much comes down to this.

Your on the train tracks.

The train is speeding at you.

And you can't understand why that big "ole" train won't stop for little "ole" you because you are such a nice person,never hutin nobody, why would the train want to hurt "me".

So being the martyr that you are you stay your ground and try to use your magic will power to derail the train.

I'll give you three choices of what is going to happen next and the first choice doesn't count.

Lets hope you got off the tracks and learned something that then you can apply next time you see something coming right at you.

Tyger said, "I've been getting a ton of heat in here, but I pretty much expected it."

You were wise to have expected it, and you're courageous for posting, anyway. You can teach a lesson to those who would sling arrows at people that they do not even know, or take the time to personally know, BEFORE slinging the arrows.

Tsk, tsk.

Thanks for posting, Tyger. Heck, you even have a twin, Tyyger ! Posting from WA, too. Surprised ? The IP address is from the Seattle service area.

Tyger, stop pressing buttons, will you ?

honestly, is this the Tyger show?

Tyger.
Thanks for tips on Venona and Anatomy---I ordered a pbk copy of Hammond's book. Looks more interesting than Venona---just read a bunch of reviews.

As for concerns of "leftism"---although I am not so "right" my mere mention that I register GoP at my workplace draws out the ire of my colleagues. Social workers, psychologists and doctors as well as drug addicts and mental patients tend to want to Hillaryize the universe with "free" health care for all [could it be a selfish reason?]... and they really hate Bush with a passion that defies reason... if only political choice was that simple.

On the other hand, there is a fine journalist account of extreme right wingnuts after WW2 that also set up our current political "new age" climate. One, a good read I recall now is "Inside the League: The Shocking Expose of How Terrorists, Nazis, and Latin American Death Squads Have Infiltrated the World Anti-Communist League" by Scott Anderson and Jon Lee Anderson (1986)

we could carry on about this in private email...

--but so much of New Age combines the worst of left and right [brain, wing, coast] due to its anti-intellectual, emo-experience orientation.

The channeling craze is "the ultimate democratization of religion" according to Marcello Trucci, yet, all channeling, to me, is by nature a dictatorship, if nothing else, of the "Higher Self" dictating reality to the "lower dog" in the channeler's now disintegrated self.

I enjoy feeling integrated and I really try to avoid acting like a puppy....

Anti-intellectual, emo-oriented...
You can't accuse R of that...SCIENCE as GOD is just as bad, I think, as any new ager's preferred belief system....

Wolfman;

I had no idea you provided personal psycho-analysis for free here.

Why thank you!!!

whatcha;

LOL!!! Thanks for understanding. This is njot the only forum I write in or post on. But thanks...

joe;

Interesting stuff and perhaps we should carry on in private mail...(LOL!!!)

I'm going to research and check out the references you posted...good stuff, and I'm always interested in new angles, as long as they aren't coming from Bellevue.....if you get my drift.

I'll close with this:

If the general public knew about Venona and cared as much as they hang onto their Roswell myths....the world and our government would be a VASTLY different place.

Alternate time-lines, anyone?

Tree;

This happens wherever I go and write or post on the Internet. It's like the second I start typing a lightning rod goes up.

The only alternative is for me to quit posting here and go to other forums and sites.

Tyger:
you have welcomed those who agree with you and have been sarcastic and condescending to those who do not.

Where is there a middle of the road approach? And if you are not liking the responses, do, post elsewhere.

If you are, indeed, going to post, you might better stand the heat in the kitchen. Better yet, quit slamming those who don't agree with you.
Ever hear of a D I S C O U R S E ?
do you only know argument?

Please, play nice.
All of us here have already had enough of that abusive sandbox.
If you don't like this sandbox, maybe find another where people enjoy being
abused for "lack of knowledge."

Your lack of compassion and understanding
really shows all colors.

Tree....."Tyger your lack of compassion and understanding really shows all colors".

My dear dear little tree.

Its all right little one.

There will always be different color houses in the neighborhood unless one lives in a zoo where all the houses are the same plain color.

Your plain house color is fine with me. I enjoy it. It reminds me that there are milk and cookies inside.

But when I eat too many milk and cookies I get fat and lazy and then I can't have a good time over at Tyger's red house where I like to "wrasle" with myself.

"Parlay" is a very interesting word my dear little Tree. Study it. It helps to make the little tree's grow up to big strong tree's that then can provide protection to all the other little saps.

Okay....LOL!!! That last line made me laugh out loud for real..."grow up to be big trees that can protect all the little sap(ling)s"

LMFAO!!!!!

(that's a keeper, Wolf...)

Lost in space,
It is statements like this:
"You can't accuse R of that...SCIENCE as GOD is just as bad, I think, as any new ager's preferred belief system.... "
that cause Tygers to growl...

Tyger has a caustic, hyper, perhaps conspiratory style [I'm not biting on that Kremlin thing because I think I know where that comes from....later on that]
but I can tell all of you that his keystrokes are on the pulse of what recovery from cult-think requires in the wider ex-member community, especially among folks recovering from New Age/channeling/psychic/neo-occult/Self-realization hybrid-hindu agendas....from RSE.

"Science as God" is a cliche among anti-intellectual types who refuse to see that science as properly applied is not dictatorial or absolutist. The latter is called "scientism." If you are arguing with "scientism" then you have cut me out of the discussion by labelling me [and perhaps the tygers among us as well] as something I am not. I do not worship science.
JZ/RSE's pseudo-science approach comes from the same impulse as her pseudo religious approach--JZ is ILL-educated about science and religion and so much more. Neo-occult gurus [a good ex. is Rudolf Steiner], especially since the 19th century, have been trying to use "mental power" or "direct knowledge" to override history, science, consensus religion, aesthetic philosophy, and all that tends to be reality based.

I am not saying everyone has to be a "scientist" to recover from cult ideation, but it helps to appreciate the science that helps us separate fact from fantasy.

Since the 90s I've been recommending "How To Think About Weird Things: Critical thinking for a New Age" by Theodore Schick and Lewis Vaughn [newest edition is 2004]

Almost all my ex-neo-occult clients that cared to make the effort have glowed with reports of how that one volume cleared out so many cobwebs and bats from their attic ...er, brain matter.

keep me/us in the converstation... hope I made some sense here

Whoaaaa!!! Thank you, joe!!! Seriously...

of course Tyger.
Again, anyone who agrees with you.
What a caustic *******.

I see the science Joe.

Try and restrain your personal insults....I was commenting to Wolf.

Joe;

"I am not saying everyone has to be a "scientist" to recover from cult ideation, but it helps to appreciate the science that helps us separate fact from fantasy."


"Science" for me is another word for "logic proven through extended experience". It's tested and proven, as ALL things in the universe have been that any of us can possibly relate to with any meaningful interaction. Even "near-death" experiences have a medical record to back up the questions that are obviously forthcoming.

But Scamtha????

Nada.......

Not a shred....just pure Lilliputian fantasies. Straight out of Walt Disney's best dreams.....or nightmares.

Joe...it was just your statement I took exception to, was not accusing you of anything...I know your God is not science, was referring to the fact that, along with needing to (I agree) develop healthy skepticism when leaving R land, some ex students also may need to reconnect with their EMOTIONAL wiring, and making emotions sound like a dysfunctional thing to have, or an irrational impulse, is probably not so helpful to them. I know your God is not science...and Tyger, I don't find you as offensive as perhaps you intend...you really are a TIGGER...as far as I'm concerned you can keep bouncing here.

Tyger:
Please go to U-Tube, and type in "Bush is an alien" on the search bar...really really funny to me...but wonder, since this is a direct attack on Republicans, whether it will be screamingly funny to you too. It's all very well to ridicule others' beliefs, but you should expect the same in return, as I think you do.
I personally can take endless jokes at my expense...but I think scorn for others is uglier than hatred.

Lost In Space posted, "and Tyger, I don't find you as offensive as perhaps you intend...you really are a TIGGER...as far as I'm concerned you can keep bouncing here."

Personally, I agree with you, Lost In Space. I also don't think Tyger intends the level of negativity that is being attributed to him. I think it's perhaps personal buttons that are being pressed.

Rebutting perceived flames by calling him a caustic b.a.s.t.a.r.d. is inappropriate for this forum and imo, an apology would be in order.

Awwwww;

I got called a "Tigger"!!! That's how my wife see's me....lol...unless I'm yelling. (LOL....just joking!!! Lighten up, folks...)

"B*A*S*T*A*R*D": BAttlefield Satelite Transmitting And Receiving Device. (excerpted from "The Phoenix Imperative by 'Tyger')

Yeah, .....I guess that's me. I don't mind the name.

Tyger, you are very naughty. You punctuate your writing with tasty bits of polarized "off-topic" fluff, then skip away "laughing fit to bust" so to speak. Naughty! LOLissimo!

Lost in Space
thanks for clarifying. I pushed my own button by misunderstanding you.
I have problems any more with disintegrative language about human beings. I despise "higher self/lower self" "body/mind" "intellectual/emotional bodies" but I realize we need those simple designations as metaphors to communicate aspects of human personality.

When all these horses of emotion, intellect, perception, appreciation, expression, and biomass, are pulling our wagons together they work as one and it is hard to tell one from the other.

The relentless criticism of our "self" and what is not "perfected" about us in totalist cults tends to disintegrate us into rounds of guilt and shame for not ever being able to measure up with one or more of our horses.

But I see what you mean..we tend to identify psychic pain with emotional being.

Joe said, "When all these horses of emotion, intellect, perception, appreciation, expression, and biomass, are pulling our wagons together they work as one and it is hard to tell one from the other."

Joe, this is what I meant in a previous post that I made, when I said at some point, that we could work toward becoming "balanced".

Of course, the cult experience, despite "how could anyone so stupid get caught up in such a thing", put anyone, at least for a while, out of "balance".

You summed it right up !