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The core concepts forming the introductory level of the JZ/Ramtha teaching have been explored to some degree by every major civilization.
Great and subtle minds have churned over these ideas for centuries. Ms. Knight’s mind, neither great nor subtle has, I believe, has concocted a perfect storm of neurosis, selected bits of philosophy and Manchurian Candidate techniques designed to ensnare and appeal to the wounded parts of the human psyche.
The wounded part of the human psyche: That part of us seeking redemption through punishment and freedom through debasement has found a home at Ms. Knight’s school of “enlightenment”
The core ideas: self generated reality, variations on pantheism, panentheism etc. have had devotees and debunkers for many centuries. They are not new.
How then, does JZ Knight, self deified and now eerily botoxed, retain such a devoted audience? The answer I believe is where her neurosis meets the student’s neurosis and an unholy, unquestioning dance begins.
The origins of Ms. Knight’s erratic and often punishing and abusive style of “teaching” could be reasonably understood in basic psychological terms.
If a cable sales executive told you to get up at dawn and run through a maze while breathing heavily in order to achieve enlightenment [after spending years telling everyone you don’t have to “do” anything to be enlightened] you might think twice about signing up for that.
Sans Ramtha, JZ Knight is just that. An ex cable sales executive who either had a genuine transcendent experience she was not equipped or willing to understand or a shrewd con artist with a business plan.
I believe in the case of JZ Knight, the truth, as almost always, is somewhere in the middle
JZ Knight appears to be as a sadist who enjoys punishing the people who have given her their money and trust in the hopes of gaining freedom and power.
Whatever genuine experience she had in the beginning has clearly been replaced by these traits so dominant in her psyche.
For people in her school, I think the question to ask is “why do I think I deserve to be treated like this”
I know the rap is it helps you to become allowing or some such crap but psychologically speaking it is a well known tactic of mind control. To wear somebody down for “their own good” to “teach them to be strong”
Like parents who beat their children for their own good. Or spouses who abuse the other for “their own good”
The truly strong wouldn’t put up with her bag of bull**** for more than a minute. She has to wear down your self respect and your psychological integrity to maintain her hold on you as a follower.
JZ gets away with this using a well worn tactic of manipulators everywhere. She doesn’t tell you what she is doing [she may not even know herself] She tells you instead she is doing the opposite. She is not enslaving you, no, she is teaching you how not to be enslaved by yelling at you, exhausting you, demeaning you and taking your money.
Basically the dynamic is “I will abuse you while telling you that you are god and my abuse will help you realize your godhood”
The mind snaps trying to make those two concepts real. What does it mean to “be god”? You are already god or you are not. What does it look like? Since you are “god” shouldn’t you go about defining that yourself?
Who cares if you can manifest something out of thin air if you haven’t practiced the art of loving or the art of caring? What good is it?
Crap. Utter crap. JZ RELIES on you not getting it. She is hoping you don’t get it and she uses fear and abuse to keep you from realizing it.
All businesses operate on a similar principle. They don’t sweat losing a few customers who claim to have gotten all they can from a product and are satisfied and move on. They let those people go. They use their testimonials and rely on them for word of mouth.
However all business rely on REPEAT BUSINESS to stay alive. JZ is running her business like any other. The only problem is her business is YOUR brain.
Why is she doing this? It is very possible she is a sick woman who is in desperate need of help herself.
She seems to revel in the idea that she is a martyr for her cause, taking a bizarre satisfaction in stating she will be “attacked’
It’s a story that has been acted out before by people throughout history trying to out maneuver Jesus as the most wronged person on the planet.
It could be argued that “you teach what you are”. In Ms. Knight’s case that is certainly, in my view, her greatest teaching.
JZ Knight does not behave like a woman who knows she creates her own reality. If she knew this, she would not feel the need to resort to the manipulations and chicanery she has over the years.
"Basically the dynamic is “I will abuse you while telling you that you are god and my abuse will help you realize your godhood” "
very well stated, and also the dynamics of the
"cycle of abuse".
The thing is, while IN such a cycle, one does not KNOW they are in it.
Let's say you live in a little cabin and it smells like propane.
One day, for some unexplained reason, you forgot you left your wallet on the front porch.
You step out, smell the re-freshing air, make a quick mental note of "wow! this is different." and you proceed back inside.
A few weeks later, being consumed by the propane smell, you vaguely recall that breath of fresh air.
You step outside, linger a while, getting your brain re-freshed as well, but , uh, oh, this is scary!
And you run back inside.
A while passes again, you are practically nauseated with the smell of the propane.
Finally, you say to yourself,"God!! I don't care what it takes!! Give me that fresh air!!"
You grab your wallet and slame the door, never to go back in.
*DeNotes... I also enjoyed reading your post -- the comment that comes to mind is that I think it is probably a bit simplistic to say that students are attracted to JZ because of their need to redeem themselves through punishment.... I think in the case of my mother and sister this is what is so bizarre about their being caught up in JZ... Both of them are very passive, kind, people... and abhor mistreatment of anyone, including themselves... But it obviously appealing to some emotional niche, I'm just not convinced that is the one....
I told my mother today that while she is sitting in the mud in Blue College this month, that she might want to think about maybe next time planning a vacation that includes a posh hotel, with satin sheets and chocolate on the pillow -- because THAT is what she deserves!!...
I think, it would probably be more accurate to compare the relationship to an abusive spouse -- people become entangled in these relationships not because they like it or seek it out, on a conscious level anyway, but usually because it follows a family pattern of what they grew up with... and it is, on a subconscious level, what they are used to, in the sense only that we tend to seek the familiar... and act out bad familial relationships until they are "resolved"...
Yes, perhaps as I wrote it an oversimplification, let me expand.
The point is that this type of dynamic requires a person to diminish his/her sense of value. If everyone in JZ's school was thinking for themselves she would have no control. The best way to implement control to a large group is to diminish the individuals sense of value and tie a sense of grandiosity to belonging to the group.
The dynamic goes like this "you are god" and "you are stupid, idiotic unevolved for not realizing it" you feel exalted and fearful and shameful all at the same time.
I would just add a person can appear very powerful but internally experience great weakness.
I think JZ for instance, feels very weak and out of control. That is why she needs to use the traditional stroke then abuse technique of mind control.
I would just observe that a sense of worthlessness can be cultivated if you didn't feel it to begin with.
Just like successful women can become shadows of their former selves in abusive marriages, anyone can be diminished when subject to this level of manipulation.
Oh and Marie, yes I would also say this dynamic isn't initiated on the level of choice that you decide say what to have for dinner.
I would say yes, people are trained early to accept levels of abuse and people like JZ are able to make good use of that early training.
I wonder how many people in the school have a history of abuse.
*DM, your understanding of this woman is top shelf, clinically right-on. Lots of people in the school have abuse history, many emf posts addess this. keep up the great posts.
Truly a fabulously wealthy post!
I'll donate $$$ to buy newspaper space to air your post at the top of this page.
Maybe even rent the plane that drops tens of tens of thousands of copies of that post all over the compound of JZK Inc.
Wouldn't that be a riot! A whole RSE event where the students only discipline would be going around picking up all the copies of dens "Fabulously Wealthy Top Post" that are laying on the ground and in the bushes and hanging from trees, all while mumbling, "i am fabulously wealthy".
Wolf --- Hahahahaha... yes!
Sad to hear. I hope people wise up and realize they are just redressing their initial abuser in a new age gown with JZ.
If something " hurts for your own good", question. Its nearly always bullsh**
I think thats a good motto.
Seriously, this language is too much "disciplines"??? I imagine JZ would have had quite a career, albiet not as lucrative a one as a dominatrix.
But then you can only torture one person at a time, so its not very efficient.
The irony of it all is that she seems to hold the position that she is the most tortured wronged woman on the planet.
I don't know much about RSE, that predates my involvement with JZ?/Ramtha but all of her excercises and all this stuff about "blue colleges" and "red guards" sound really dungeons and dragons to me.
I should have said my involvement predates the school so much of this terminology is absolutely foreign to me.
I haven't heard anyone mention another possible motivation that keeps intelligent people slogging through the disciplines at the Ranch: the "Outward Bound" or the boot camp factor. Don't RSE students take great pride in facing physical and mental challenges that test them, much like they are told that ancient schools of wisdom tested their initiates?
I seem to recall that in his book Iron John, Robert Bly wrote about how our modern society is lacking the initiations that used to mark entry into adulthood (read: wisdom) in past cultures. I think he said that one reason many youths get caught up in gangs is that they are trying to give themselves their own initiation experiences. The longing for elders to pass on wisdom is also not satisfied in our society.
I've certainly come across current students with the attitude that those who leave RSE do so because they can't "cut it." Could it be that JZ was shrewd enough to design a program that makes her students feel superior to non-students, in part because they feel they have "the right stuff" and also because they think they are being initiated by the ultimate elder? Is all this one reason that they will take whatever J/R dishes out, without ever feeling abused?
OneHand, that's an interesting observation... I know though with my mother and sister neither of them were ever particularly competitive... Almost the opposite, really....perfectionistic in an unrealistic way, yes.. but they are both more comfortable as dreamers than doers... If that makes any sense.
"However all business rely on REPEAT BUSINESS to stay alive. JZ is running her business like any other. The only problem is her business is YOUR brain."
This is the one that gets me and disturbs me equally. She, as others have, have spawned this new generation of mutated snake oil salesmen/women. The diference between them and the older versions is that they do not even need to carry an inventory of bottles, lables, wagons to travel to their victims. In this case, one is the inventory themselves, the product is their own brain and the pay to bring the inventory.
Little do they know that when they get their inventory back it has been repackaged, with the original missing and a cheap recording in its place!
"I haven't heard anyone mention another possible motivation that keeps intelligent people slogging through the disciplines at the Ranch: the "Outward Bound" or the boot camp factor. Don't RSE students take great pride in facing physical and mental challenges that test them, much like they are told that ancient schools of wisdom tested their initiates?"
You are quite correct, that is a large part of why people keep going back. There is a bonding factor that occurs when a group of people experience a "trauma" together. JZ is more then happy to orchestrate these incidents and put a couragous spin on them. It is similar to New Yorkers after 911, californians after an earthquake, etc. surviving the common event that seemed to challange ones survivability. To look at others who have goten through the same thing can be quite empowering.
In audiences, there are many times when Ramther will discuss ex-students. They are referred to as quitters, and other negative adjectives. So, current students look down upon them. It's common for an ex-student to be dissed by a current student, without regard to length of tenure. Ramther forming a picture of loser ex-students as "less than" quitters, also fosters an attitude within a person that they will be tough (that's acceptable if not desirable), and certainly not a quitter !
Can't have too many quitters... $$$$$$