I was watching this guy on youtube, his story is probably one told by many people, friends and family of RSE members. Its not unique and I am sure many of the ex-Ramsters on this forum would have had friends who felt the same. Its so sad watching someone you care about involve themselves in a cult.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_e6J7dpA8k

thanks Aussiegirl....
maybe more people will post stuff on YouTube about that. I left a comment
about enlighten me free dot com

Thats a good idea Tree, I was thinking of doing that myself. I decided to have a look at a couple of Ramtha videos, the short ones on ramtha.tv (i'd never really watched any before) and to someone on the outside she is laughable, I just don't understand how my partner can believe her. She really preys on people's weaknesses and insecurities and whats with the silly accent that keeps changing all the time, its different in every video. Sometimes I think I'm better off not knowing too much or it will really damage my relationship.

Aussiegirl-
What TOTALLY helped me in seeing through
this charade was when during my
exit counseling (the initial 3 days with
a professional who methodically took me through the path to see), was a video tape
of ANOTHER former student's experience at RSE-it was their "exit interview"
after having worked with the exit counselor for 4-5 solid days.
(The family had hired the exit counselor to intervene as
the man was going to move to Yelm,
sell his two businesses, and leave his
family behind in another country.)
When I saw that video, a similar idea to the YouTube one,that really solidified the entire concept of the group being
cohersively persuasive.

Hang in there.
The more that word gets out and people get
educated, the more people's cages will be rattled, then the false
house of cards can come tumbling down.

and while I am on the topic of
exit counselling, I just read of
a family's request to intervene in
their son's newly found group during a
rare Christmas break he took from the
group.
The exit counselor spent 4 days with this family and the son.
The son, at the end of the stay, said,
he would take it back to his
group and think it over.
The next year, both his parents,
after having been "gifted" by their son,
some events in this group,
later joined the group.

I think timing is everything.

Tree,

In addition, I think other family dynamics need to be considered -- sometimes the family unit just can't bear losing the loved one, no matter what... so in that case, joining the group themselves seems less painful than losing the son... I guess it would be "enabling" to an exaggerated degree... I have seen families in which parents buy / supply / support their children's heroin habits because they just can't bear to let events unfold that might take their child from them...

Also, in my own family at this time, I have seen many dynamics coming into play recently that have been lurking beneath the surface for years... The hard part is figuring out how much of it is due to RSE, and how much is just the regular old family dynamic...and I guess really, it doesn't matter.

And I guess what surprises me more than anything, is the rest of my family's reaction to "all of this"... No one who is involved or needs to be, wants to deal with it... My mother has shut me out on the topic -- don't talk about it or I'm leaving NOW -- and my sister has shut me out altogether..."you HAVE lost a sister"... My extended family has made it clear they don't want to discuss it...I can see if we had discussed it ad nauseum and then they say "ok, we're done discussing, this is how we feel and we think what your mother does is her own business".. but there has been NO discussion.. As soon as I broached the subject I was sent emails AND snail mail telling me not to bring it up again... My father, who is probably the least inclined to distance from me and not involved in RSE at all, but still no rock of gibraltor in the way of being supportive, kind of adopted the "so what" attitude.. "You know your mother has always been into this kind of thing, it's just another wacko phase she's going through"... Nevermind the details indicating this particular wacko phase might have serious and/or long term consequences...

So for me... it's not just that my mother and sister are "involved in some cult"... It's that I feel like I've just lost 3/4 of my whole family...

It is a very painful experience to feel that one has lost 3/4 of their family. But you have gained us...and we understand.

Marie write; ''''My father, who is probably the least inclined to distance from me and not involved in RSE at all, but still no rock of gibraltor in the way of being supportive, kind of adopted the "so what" attitude.. "You know your mother has always been into this kind of thing, it's just another wacko phase she's going through"... Nevermind the details indicating this particular wacko phase might have serious and/or long term consequences...''''

Marie, if your father could see what your mother is enduring during these events, he might have another perspective. The primaries are held in March. The ENTIRE field is mud. People are wearing blindfolds, hundreds of people, and trying to find their cards. At the end of this field is a creek, dry in the summer. Cards are place on that fence as well. One side has a drop-off into the water. Even when the field has dried a bit, those going into the creek come out and the whole thing is like wading through inches of slick mud, In fact, that's exactly what it is. People have to get up at the "bell" before sunrise to 'grid' the sky. Some teachers are okay with people being late, while others are downright mean and lock the gate as though it's a punishment. It doesn't matter if it's raining, freezing, you still sit there in the dark on the ground, then do the 'walk' before you can even eat. In that field, people constantly walk into or bang into one another and fall. But, hey, that's their reality, right? I don't think so. It's a dangerous situation and reeks of old time military training. People out in the tents, if there is a change in the very dark, wet and cold morning, a red guard rides a bicycle with yelling out to everyone. I can't believe I did this. I still can't believe it. I was under the impression the big guy 'protected' everyone and kept them 'healthy' during events. Not so. I was sick each and every time after. People were so sick this year with fevers and sore throats they couldn't talk, and attributed it to 'reaching fifith seal' - speak only truth. I just continue to find more and more contradictions and surprises, to the point it's all a bunch of ****, what they're teaching. I do believe meditation has its place for relaxation, stress reduction. But RSE's was insidious trance induction so we could all be, "robots."

If your father saw what your mother endures, he probably would be appalled. One thing that would interfere with my concentration in the field was that I would knock over an older person and hurt them. Well, you're just not supposed to think about those things! Sorry, but I'm humane, and refuse to step on my 'brothers and sisters.'

Tell your mother you love her, and you miss the closeness with her. I do know I've posted before that my spouse and kids told me I seemed so detached from them every time I'd come home, and then for a good time after. I was losing my 'feelings' for my own loved ones and it alarmed me. I know it's more difficult for you having other family members involved. But sloshing blindfolded through mud and creeks isn't my idea of enlightenment. I think enlightenment can take many forms. The feeling a person 'feels' when watching an astounding sunset - the beauty can provoke tears and an emotion I can't label. Maybe enlightenment is to be the best we can, in compassion and love, tolerance and nonjudgmental, just as the 'avatars' of old professed. Ask your mother, 'do you still love me, mom? Because I miss your love." If your mom decided to drop out, would your sister still accept her or cut her out? Feelings (emotions) are considered an "addiction" by the school, and JR teaches that's why we cannot evolved. So people are 'numbed' through trance and hypnotic suggestion, feel--good party music before speakers (revs up the energy levels so you don't fall asleep after watching the same video for the third time). Oh, you might want to ask your mom how she feels about the 'lizards!'

I wish you the very best.

Make sure your mom has waders for her events in the cooler months, and boots with cleats to help her trudge the slick mud. Then again, many people leave their supplies in Yelm with those who offer such services.

My heart weeps for your dilemma. Love your mother, it's the only true thing.

"Oh, you might want to ask your mom how she feels about the 'lizards!"

this is in regards to an alien race that have lizard like skin.
Many believe that people in high ranking
positions of power are part of this
"lizard group" (the queen of Englang
being one example, the lizard enities
supposedly seen in the Bald Hills of
Yelm, being another).

sounds like someone(jz)was on the David Icke website...Monotamic(sp?) Gold...200 year old lizards in the Palace...

The only thing I have taken from David is that the religions on the planet are to control( I agree with that statement)the churchs' are a business (money makes the world go round)...I mean why do I need to be a "God Fearing" person?...if I have to fear "GOD" (whatever that means to each)..then I don't want to be apart of that....

I can't decide if all of this sounds more like someone's bad acid trip or an old Star Trek episode -- actually, more like like Stalin's bad acid trip while watching Star Trek!

My partner actually has concerns I am a Reptilian - I just think its very funny

Y(Ickes)!

Just for one moment (oh here goes out with the critical thinking...suspend belief for a few seconds only if you wish) -but so what if someone was? (taking leave of senses and wondering why it would bother anyone if something as such were/is possible?) Why so much fear and concern? (keep in mind I was indoctrinated fairly well, yet had precious little background on the school)

Aussie girl-
Where are you and how are you ? and how are you and the BF?

How do you reach someone who doesn't want help? Are you supposed to just sit back and watch a families relationships dissolve? How do you effectively help when your up against a long time advanced student who is determined to "create their day" no matter who gets hurt? It's frustrating.......
This Knight woman should be charged with "alienation of affection" for what she preaches to her followers about breaking up existing realtionships.
Just my opinion! And sorry if I sound a little bit p#%@ed off.

Diane-
I don't think you can help where help
is not wanted.
While in RSE, I felt the same. I know where
the students are coming from.
I never had gone so far as taking a "manifestation" of mine own as someone
else's loss, but that is wide spread.
And if you ever approach anyone who is deeply entrenched,
they will either blow you off with a
wry smile ( as In, "I know more than you do, you ignoramous") or literally say
f you (because that I what "Ramtha" teaches).
All the people who know I am out who are still in RSE, look at me like I have
eight heads.
But, I think if a former, very sincere, very practicing student goes AWOL, I think
it would shock their former friends to the core.
At least SOME
WHERE in their brain, the thoughts and posts of EMFers will stick, and one day
bubble to the surface when their own
red flags go up.
If it were me in your shoes, I would do something insanely shocking with an educational jab, and then let them walk away.
They WILL think about it some time.
Maybe later, maybe sooner.
But don't nag.
They will turn a deaf ear.

From Malignant Pied Pipers of Our Time by Dr Olsson
Chapter Eight: Fighting Back

What to do if someone you know joins a destructive cult — what works, what doesn’t, what might be effective. Illustrated by case studies. What can we as a society do to change the conditions that make people more vulnerable to cults and apocalyptic scenarios? Can they be identified before they can hurt people or families?
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

Thanks Tree,

I'll pass this on to my friend. There are two adult children involved who are angry. I just don't know how to help her. I don't know what attracted her husband to this woman, except he may not have known about the cult at first. Its very wierd, he's distant, almost without emotion, like his ex of xx years and children never existed. He does seem to have an attitude of indifference. I'm trying to give her as much support as I can, I just hope its the right support. She's afraid to enter this sight, and afraid of the cult. Should she be?

Diane said, "He does seem to have an attitude of indifference."

This is promoted there.
Students are basically taught to overcome their emotional body as it is only a chemical reaction, which will mislead them based on their past encoded reactions in the brain, resurfacing.

Well, to transcend that pesky emotional body, one does not feel love (we don't know what it is, you see), and we don't feel hate (because that is just the opposite of love). So, what do we want to feel ? We want to feel INDIFFERENCE.

So, a sign of being Evolved, is being able to stoically look at someone, see/hear/witness their "stuff/drama", and then just walk away because you are just soooooo detached from their human drama.

Does this now paint a clearer picture of WHY the students who are capable of this pathetic if not frightening behavior (ain't nuttin' fourth seal about it !) act as they do ???

This is a christ in the making, don't you know ?

Daine-
so the husband is involved in RSE?

the woman truly should...look at this site...because there are other posters
(Marie, zyx,bud) who are in her same postion.
By all means, yes, tell her.

AS for the husband, let the wife post.
We can tell where he is at in his indoctrination.....

So, a sign of being Evolved, is being able to stoically look at someone, see/hear/witness their "stuff/drama", and then just walk away because you are just soooooo detached from their human drama.

Watcha,
That's exactly what he's like.

Tree,

Yes it's the husband. I am going to try to get her to look at this site, and maybe she can find comfort in communicating with all of you. I certainly hope so. If nothing else she'll realize she's not at fault for anything, and there are people who will understand how deeply she is hurting.

Thanks for all your help

"So, a sign of being Evolved, is being able to stoically look at someone, see/hear/witness their "stuff/drama", and then just walk away because you are just soooooo detached from their human drama."

The thing is, the people acting like this cannot SEE that this is not normal behavior.
And to boot, they feel more superior becuase those
who have not had these sacred teachings first hand,
are definitely 'less' than.
And again, they know not what they do.

It is not until you are OUT, (and there needs to be some time in this OUT phase) that you realize what
you were doing, esp to others.

THis makes it very very difficult to have any kind of
normal conversation, because they are living (in their head) an entirely different belief system than
those who do not attend RSE.

And no, your friend should not be afraid to read and educate herself.
Knowledge is power.

I might add, "R" uses that quote quite a bit, but he/she uses it in a very narcissistic way-meaning
his/her teachings are the true knowledge.

So I am using the "knowledge is power" thing in terms
of scientific professionals who have studied these
groups for YEARS.
Look on the main page of sources or references.
Anything by Margaret Singer, Janja Lilich, Dr Olsson,
Joe Szimhart...have here start there.

And tell her she has several people her on EMF to support her. We know, we have all been affected one
way or another.

"THis makes it very very difficult to have any kind of
normal conversation, because they are living (in their head) an entirely different belief system than
those who do not attend RSE."
Exactly Tree. After I left, any conversation I had in the real world with anyone with a spiritual bent ended with a stalemate- me thinking they were morons, and that that I knew "the" truth because I had been in the school. I must have sounded like an idiot. Everything was filtered through the school and the atitudes that are Yelm/Ranch centered. It is humbling to think how much I closed myself off from, due to my own attitude towards those who were not in RSE.
On the other hand I look at the new age community today in general and see that it all runs in cycles- and that part of Spiritual Growth is having to gain ones own truth- no more books, props, reading, channelings,ritual or assorted spiritual shortcuts will get you there. Just sincere individual effort.

all youpeople who have partners going to get sucked into rse this is out of the book from a true fanatic and shows the mindset you r dealing with:Ed moved to Washington and we began our journey to create a sovereign lifestyle[means living acording to jzr taught principle,not her own with a pool and a chateu full of antics] However, in the midst of this journey, a retreat in Yucca Valley, California was scheduled. I was going to attend and I asked Ed to attend with me. He refused again citing reasons of family and business.[yea honey he stayed back to feed the kids and do his job] I was concerned about Ed’s decision for I knew that if he didn’t make the choice to grow we would separate. Couples cannot remain together if they don’t grow together and I knew that.[so thats what you r up against.her husband got a ramster too]

very well said ex.
It is inevitable.
RSE breaks up couples. Period.