i am cutting/pasting the errant posts about the movie, What The Bleep on this new thread so subsequent posts can be on topic, together.

this may be an interesting viewpoint to consider...or not...

leslie said, "Most of the scientists are New Age types, except for Dr. David Alpert, a philosopher of physics, who wrote an article later saying how he was misused. The anecdotal report about the Natives not seeing Columbus’ ships is utter Euro-American trash. Most of the indigenous people of the Americas and surrounding islands had boats and would know what a big boat was. The Carib Indians traded with each from island to island by boat. The “experiment” about water was not scientifically done and never repeated. The water crystals are snowflakes and every snowflake is distinct and so it proves nothing. Spirituality connected to quantum physics is not a new idea. Read THE TAO OF PHYSICS by Fritjof Capra and THE DANCING WU LI MASTERS by Gary Zukov. Both these books have been around for a long, long time Better yet read books by Brian Greene, Stephen Hawkings, and Michio Kaku. They’ll trip you out more profoundly than this propaganda film from the Ramtha followers. This movie is just the New Age equivalent of creationism."

....and personally, I agree. I think she summed it all up quite succinctly.
Email: emailwhatchamacallit@yahoo.com


David McCarthy responded:
"The anecdotal report about the Natives not seeing Columbus’ ships is utter Euro-American trash."

I agree..

Australian petroglyph's of Sailing ships. .
Nourlangie, 31km southeast of the Bowali
images of European sailing ships,
petroglyphs, a large sailing ship moving through water, ...

North America petroglyphs
shows a vessel with blunt bow and raised deck, the people depicted are wearing long waisted coats, high boots and wide-brimmed hats - clothing typical of the 1600s.
from,,
http://museum.gov.ns.ca/imagesns/petroglyphs/P_ships.html



david,

i remember hearing "ramtha" express his distaste when he stated that the audience did not have a passion for history. his daughter, jz, did have such a passion.

well, frankly, i don't recall a poll ever being taken on who did or did not care for history. so then i would assume, perhaps that the Big Guy KNOWS that the audience didn't, overall, give a hoot about history.

if "he" did, and he said s/he DID, then why didn't the all knowing Big Guy get these facts straight about the ships ?

Ahhh, one might deduce that there isn't a Big Guy !
imagine that...
Email: emailwhatchamacallit@yahoo.com

okay, we're all caught up..........keep on posting!

Lots of background info on What the Bleep claims available as a .pdf download on this page:

http://www.conradaskland.com/blog/2005/09/report-on-the-perversion-of-science-to-support-mysticism/

thank you !

For a chuckle go to you tube and search "what the bleep are they talking about trailers"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gpgirbrpYU&mode=related&search=

if you are talking about the Gilliland "documentary"
note the producers: Savage/Knight

The Savage boys (young men) attend RSE.
And who do you suppose this Knight person
is????

Tree,
Are you saying JZ and James Gilliland teamed up to make a movie? (Let's not dignify it word the word documentary which is far too generous.)

In my brainwashed days I read 2 of his books which are "recieved" by "Cazekiel." And what kinds of things does Cazekiel talk about? Well, on the cover of "Becoming Gods II" it says "Interdimensional Mind, Earth Changes and The Quickening, UFOs Their Origins and Intentions."

What a surprise! Haven't I heard those topics "received" elsewhere???

You know, I just don't get it...did I spend too many years doing disciplines and my brain doesn't work anymore? JZ apparently doesn't object to "Mafu" who is identical to "Ramtha" and she teams up with Gilliland who "receives" Cazekiel. Please tell me it is not just about

i know the boys (Chase, in particular) were very involved in the production, and both boys worked at the ranch when I did, and how they can go from $10 /hour jobs to producing a documentary without some kind of capitol is beyond me.

all I know...is that one minute, I am working at the ranch with both boys.One decided to go to graphic animation school (or something close) the other decides to take off on a fishing trek to Alaska for
several weeks(their parents have money).
Next thing I know, I run into the the older one, and he tells me he is working on this movie.
I had no clue it was channeled material.
hmmmmm
and no conflict of interest?

Watcha said..

"i remember hearing "ramtha" express his distaste when he stated that the audience did not have a passion for history."

That a fine line coming from a none-existent Cro-Magnon to accuse others…
while in the same breath.. Berate them all for living in the past!

What is the life lesson in this?
Never trust an antique dealer who runs a school of enlightenment pretending to be an ascended Cro-Magnon!

Dark chuckle...

Back to the W T Bleep Ramtharian history lesson of the Natives not seeing Columbus’ ships.
Here’s some more info on… ancient North American Ship Petroglyphs…
Fascinating stuff..

David.

************************************8

The Ship Petroglyphs
Evidence of the presence of ancient European and Mediterranean people in the interior of the United States is found in the numerous images of their ships incised or pecked into stone. Some of these are associated with inscriptions in Old World alphabets and languages. Most have been found on the streams and rivers that are tributaries of the Mississippi River, but some have been found elsewhere, near waterways in the Rio Grande and Colorado River systems. Still others have been found far from presently navigable rivers.
Beginning in 1973 I have recorded these beautiful ship petroglyphs. Many were found by my exploring parties, still others were contributed by friends. There is now a total of forty-eight ship images from Oklahoma, Colorado, New Mexico, Arizona, Utah and California in my files. This is probably but a small fraction of the ship petroglyphs yet to be recorded in North America.
It is remarkable that no two of the ship petroglyphs are alike, and none are exact duplicates of Old World ships. Yet each American petroglyph has features which may be found in some Old World counterpart. Some of the ship petroglyphs and similar images from the Old World are presented. These comparisons are not to be taken to mean that the people who made the two images, an ocean apart, came from the same culture and time. The development of the Old World ships was gradual, and certain maritime features were shared among different cultures, or are common in ships from different periods. However, some of the comparisons are striking, and the American ship petroglyphs almost speak for themselves. Six of the ships are shown in other chapters and twenty-four are described here.

The Rebus Ship
The greatest thrill of discovery is usually when you find the first of something. The first ship petroglyph was found on July 12, 1973, in Picture Canyon, Colorado, near the Oklahoma border. It was almost missed, as it was pecked on the slanting underside of a boulder. It is probably the most distinctive of the ship petroglyphs because it is made of ancient script in the form of a rebus. The type of rebus encountered in Colorado is a drawing of an object made up of the letters that spell the word for the object. The letters are also arranged in the exact order needed to spell the word. Let's look at an example of how a rebus could be made.
Link….
http://www2.privatei.com/~bartjean/chap2.htm

************************************************************************************

"In Plain Sight"

Old World Records in Ancient America
By Gloria Farley
Gloria Farley’s work started as a casual investigation into a local curiosity. This investigation turned into a fifteen year quest which ended in the recognition of the Heavener Runestone as the work of ancient Viking travelers and its protection within a state park. Evidence of other visitors also came her way. These includes petroglyphs that record their names, drawings of the ships that brought them here, artifacts they left behind, and a solar observatory that they constructed to mark the passing of the seasons.

Link..
http://www2.privatei.com/~bartjean/mainpage.htm

Actually, the trailers I was refering to are of a parody of WTB and are comical. If you search "what the bleep are they talking about" on youtube you will find them

that is what I did..
and that is what I got

post a definitive URL

http://youtube.com/watch?v=kQOIuibXn0Q&mode=related&search=

http://youtube.com/watch?v=vDoaKHpbsFs&mode=user&search=

http://youtube.com/watch?v=JEKll2Bu99s&mode=user&search=

http://youtube.com/watch?v=P4jn9A6Mft8&mode=user&search=

Sorry it should have been search "What The Bleep Are You Talking About?"

Thank you journeythroughramthaland.........

How about this one?

Link…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2HpZyd1r4E

Hello David,

according to this article, there are already 3 new films in the process:

http://wisdom-magazine.com/Article.aspx?articleID=243

LIFTING THE VEIL (produced by THE SECRET team)
SEROTONIN RISING (http://www.serotoninrising.com)
WAKE UP

I don't have any additional info, but maybe someone here is going to do some research.

''LIFTING THE VEIL (produced by THE SECRET team)
SEROTONIN RISING (http://www.serotoninrising.com)
WAKE UP''

''Lifting the Veil'' is a commonly-used phrase in the Buddhist tradition, ie 'lifting the veil of illusion.' These people think they're telling the world something new? Hindus and Buddhists knew this long ago. Serotonin. I certainly hope no one attempts to 'copyright' THIS word -ha ha. You can't 'copyright' a neurotransmitter! This stuff was known long before JR opened shehe's mouth. 'Wake up?' Heard my mother say this every morning when I was in high school.

Nice try, whoever is 'trying.' If they take their stuff to the eastern world, I doubt these 'movies' would 'wake up' anyone since these people grew up with the idea of reincarnation and karma and kundalini (pronounced KOON-DUH-LEENIE unlike Greg's pronunciation which drove me up a wall). But I digress. The western world finds these things 'new' but most here know they are taken from eastern teachings. Does that make them wrong? No, I don't think so. It's just the source in the western world and driving force - money- money- money- money--

Hey David,

That was a riot!! Nearly fell off my chair, let me know if you come across any others!!

All of the youtube clips are short and fun to watch. I particularly liked the line, "What The Bleep Do We Know" is not destined to become a cult classic, it is a cult manual."

As the Big Guy says, "Tell the truth and let the chips fall where they may."

a direct quote from JZ in an interview last month in: Wisdom Magazine

I made a dramatic breakthrough 2 ½ years ago and that put me on a platform to understand the concept I had not understood before. Will Arntz and the people behind "What the Bleep", had manifested a dream to make a movie, to endeavor to explain what Ramtha’s School of Enlightenment was teaching.




http://wisdom-magazine.com/Article.aspx?articleID=243

I don't see any mention on this thread that the producers of WTB are no longer affiliated with RSE. Is that true? I heard one version of why that happened, but does anyone here have the facts?

this is what I know:

after the movie came out, JZ went to Will Arnzt and asked for a cut of the profits. he said that was not the deal. he did not come back to an event.

there was a party thrown by Betsy Chasse. JZ wanted to look at the at the guest list for the party and insisted Betsy's husband not attend. at the party, she told betsy "you and your child are going to die in a car crash next year."
Betsy was horrified. That did not happen (this past spring).

Mark Vicente, who had had the 'priviledge'
of having a nearly open door entry to JZ, told her that many of the staff was not being totally truthful to her. she called a staff meeting. when she asked the staff had they been up front with her about goings on, dead silence. Meekly, Greg Simmons said, "well, I was not totally turthful only once. And that was when you were very ill and I thought it in your best interest not to distrub you any further."
Mark was booted out the front gate.
I had not seen him at any event last year.

Are you saying JZ used her psychic powers and told Betsy Chasse she and her daughter would die in a car crash?

Surely "Ramtha" intervened and saved them thereby making Betsy indebted to "Ramtha" and JZ.

In the world of con artistry, it is called a "set up."

To Life!

Exactly!
I do not know if Betsy is current or not, but I know her husband stopped going a few years back.

another fine review....


http://blog.joshuajmorgan.com/index.php?cat=89

ditto.....
http://66.201.42.16/viewitem.php3?id=637&catid=528&kbid=ionsikc

and interesting read from a Ron Paul site:

especially-check out the scientific facts.

http://www.lawofskepticism.com/

These are referenced by wikipedia and include additional comments by me.

At the beginning of the movie, it is stated that humans only use 10% of their brains. This is an old self-help claim devised for marketing. You are only using 10%, we can get you to 50%! 100%! Almost all of the brain is being used in some fashion all the time. There are ZERO statistics supporting this claim.

The movie states humans are “90% water” when in fact newborns have around 78% body water, 1-year-olds around 65%, adult men about 60%, and adult women around 55%. If they are trying to come off as scientific, why would they get such a simple to find fact wrong? Well, it does help serve their purpose when they are talking about thoughts affecting water crystals, if they’ve got you thinking that you are practically a big water crystal…

The movie relates a story about Native Americans being unable to see Christopher Columbus’ ships. However, there is no mention of this in any of the journals of those voyages, and the oral traditions of the local population were lost in the following 150 years of Spanish rule. Totally fabricated.

It is also claimed in the movie that 20 amino acids are created in the human body. However, only 12 can be synthesized by humans; the remaining 8 amino acids are essential and must be acquired through food consumption or dietary supplementation.
Do you really want to accept their “science” when they can’t even get facts straight that could be found within a few clicks on google or in the pages of elementary school science books?
______________

This scene is a (mis)application of the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle. Basically this principle says that when studying objects on the level of quantum mechanics, as the accuracy of measuring the position of an observed object goes up, then the accuracy of measuring its momentum goes down. If one can measure the absolute position of the observed object, then the momentum cannot be measured. So we know the electron is likely roughly in some cloud around the nucleus of an atom, but we’re not sure where. The closer we get to observing where it was at any particular instant, the less we know about its momentum.

The basketball scence of What the Bleep completely misapplies this principle. The last time I checked, one of the components that makes up an atom was not a basketball. Please let me know if your research indicates anything differently.

A basketball can be represented by classical mechanics. The reason quantum mechanics was created is because classical mechanics is unable to accurately describe everything going on at the atomic level and below. One can most certainly observe determine the absolute position of a basketball, as well as its momentum.

What the Bleep implies that the basketball only exists where the observing person thinks it is. The idea is that the observation of it creates the reality of it. It actually can be bouncing around almost anywhere, but because I think it’s a foot in front of my right hand, that’s where it is. If I thought it was actually bouncing around behind me, that’s where it would be.

This is a complete falsehood. So why would they state such a thing? The scene implies that the ball can be teleported and placed wherever the the observer is thinking about it, a mind technique no doubt there are some classes you can sign up for down at Ramtha’s School of Enlightenment.

_____________________