It wasn't until I made my final decision to not return to the RSE that I realized how much stress I had been under - particularly during the first few years of "The School". My body was in total exhaustion - to the point where I went to a doctor!(Hadn't been to one in years) - actually a Naturopath. My B-12 level was the lowest the doctor had ever seen in anyone living, let alone walking around. B-12 is related to stress.
There is also a great deal of anger, hurt, frustration, confusion and lingering denial that needs to be healed. It took me repeated listenings to the tape of the "Gathering of the Eagles" to finally "get" that Ramtha isn't and never was. It's taken 13 years to speak out and take the next step in reaching out to others who have experienced the same depths of physical, mental, social, psychological and spiritual abuse. To name RSE as abusive is not the same as being "lost in victim consciousness". We are victims of a deplorable crime - the raping of our Souls. What we do with the experience is up to us.
Healing takes time - and the intention to be healed. It's easier to hold onto to the anger than to allow the healing. The longer we hold on to it, JZ wins.
The more we can reach out to each other and share our experiences - the stronger we each shall become.

GRACED STOP BEING VICTIM AND TAKE RESPONSIBILITY IN YOUR LIFE!! GEESH..COME ON.. ANYBODY WOULD TELL YOU THAT! STOP BLAMING OTHERS FOR YOUR ACTION! I LOVE YOU, AND I WOULD HELP YOU ANYTIME, BUT SERIOUSLY YOU NEED TO LET IT GO. THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH RSE,IF IT WASN'T RSE IT WOULD OF BEEN ANOTHER SCHOOL, AND ANOTHER, AND ANOTHER..THEN WHAT? WE GOT FIND SCHOOL THAT WILL MAKE YOU HAPPY?? THINK ABOUT IT

watchamacallit - am I insane or did Bobby like totally miss the point of my entry here? Talk about different perspectives.!!

stress? anger?

i never left my independence and conscience at the
door. i never put my faith in someone else. i was
only concerned with the state of my own soul. i did
what i wanted to do and did not do what i did not
want to do. and i got away with it just fine.

I remember my time in the RSE when I "believed" that the misfortunes of others
were totally their creation, “There are no victims in this world” is still is a common catch phrase with “Ramtha” students .
Here is an extreme example of this heartless doctrine..
Soon after the Tsunami tragedy where over Two Hundred Thousand Men, Women and Children lost their lives… “Ramtha” gave a teaching to the effect that
The “victims” of the Tsunami deserved to die because they did not have the wisdom..?
as the animals did… to head for higher ground...
To my knowledge not one student walked out of or spoke out against this “teaching”
Although some now regret they had not the courage to speak out at the time.

http://www.spokesmanreview.com/survey/apme/media/photo1.jpg

No Grace you are not insane..
Just reclaiming your heart and mind from the RSE snare,
This is the healing process.
I learnt a precious lesson during my time in RSE that..
Spiritual knowledge without compassion
Will argue for the darkest evil…
All in the name of God.

Thank you for your post,

David

David wrote: >>>Spiritual knowledge without compassion
Will argue for the darkest evil…
All in the name of God.<<<

Well said.

I cannot restrain myself from commenting on the tsunami comment - or any of the rest of the comments as well. This website is unbelievable. What is wrong with you people? Didn't you get any of Ramtha's teachings? Are you all absolutely daft? By the way, that means stupid. No you really didn't get it did you? No wonder you're all ****** off and resentful with your miserable lives. You didn't get it and it looks like you won't be getting it this lifetime. Just because Ramtha commented on how the animals were a **** site smarter than the humans when it came to the tsunami - well - he was right. The animals were smarter and so were the bush people that fled to the hills to avoid the tsunami. That is a fact, you know, I read it in the paper. Why did the other people perish? Because they are daft just like YOU! You're are so stuck in victim consciousness and your thinking brain that you are totally unconnected from all of nature and any truth that really exists. If you were connnected you'de be peaceful and happy and not even have the need to do this website. It's ridiculous, but I suppose you have needed to do it - since it looks like you and many others totally gave their power away to Ramtha to begin with. Something he warned you never to do. Maybe you can regain your power and grow up, and then you'll be ready to embrace what was lovingly taught to you - not by Ramtha, but by your own God, because it is you that created Ramtha, and it is YOU that live in your snivelly victimy world that refuses to understand the teachings, because if you truly embraced the teachings you'de actually have to take responsibilty for your life and everyone elses that's in your reality. But that would be thinking way too big for you. NO Martin Luther KINGS or John F. Kennedy's in this audience - that's for sure. Ramtha's teachings don't exclude compassion - you can have compassion for the tsunami victims, but to realize they created their reality by choosing what they choose, you are giving them the freedom to live their journey, and are empowering them at the same time. If you see them as victims, you have taken their power away from them, just as you do to yourself. They created their reality because they chose a life where they didn't pay attention to collective consciousness – to the Isness, the Creator, the God within all things, to the quantum field – hell whatever you want to call it. They didn’t connect with other parts of their brain through which they would have been more in touch with their intuition, their higher sense, and had they done so, they would have sensed the need to go to the hills, like the indiginous people, and hence would not have perished. They were out of touch, out of sinc, out of balance, just like most of the people on this planet, because they have not EMBRACED BEING RESPONSIBLE FOR THEIR LIVES! Just like you all are not being responsible for yours. IT DISGUSTS ME THAT THIS MUCH UNENLIGHTENMENT EXISTS AFTER SUCH AN ENLIGHTENMENT OPPORTUNITY CAME YOUR WAY - AND BY THE WAY - WHO CREATED THAT OPPORTUNITY? Oh the hell with it - this conversation is NOT worth my time. Enjoy your journey - after all it's yours and not mine. I suppose if I was really enlightened I would never have even made any comments, but rather just smiled and kept my mouth shut, but just like you perhaps I couldn't keep my mouth shut - my truth just had to come out. And I suppose I would love you and forgive you and allow you you're journey. Happy trails. And no, I'm not a current RSE student. Don't bother responding to this message - I won't be back to this website again.

Well I be darned…

When the raw nerve of hypocrisy is touched...
better be prepared for some howling..

"Former Ramtha Student" utters nothing but RSE dogma. Great example of a programmed person...

One of "Ramtha's" strongest teachings is called ALLOWING. How is it that "Former Ramtha Student" wants to be allowed to post his/her own "truth" (a famous Ramthism) yet does not allow us ours?

With regard to the recent uninformed post from the current RSE student, here is my reply, which contains a number of citations from sources that would cast doubt on the accuracy of Ramtha’s and JZ’s statement about the animals escaping the tsunami – they all did NOT escape, for one thing. That animals can detect tsunamis is speculative. Claiming it on stage without scientific PROOF, is just more pseudoscience.

Do you know what that means ? It means FALSE KNOWLEDGE, current student. You can educate yourself here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudoscience to start.

About 25,000 animals died in Hurricane Katrina
http://www.alertnet.org/thefacts/reliefresources/113172255693.htm

Elephants SEEM to communicate via low frequency soundwaves that better penetrate the jungle so you could CONSIDER that they heard the wave coming along time before humans did. But, before you start looking for sixth sense in animals you have to establish that there was something mysterious happening - which has not been done yet.

Most of the rescue effort went into towns and villages where there are few elephants and leopards in the first place, so citing, as some have done, how they escaped, is misleading. You must also consider that while the waves were devastating on the coast they would have lost a lot of power by the time they got some distance inland. While the death toll for humans was high near the coast, how bad was it at the limits of the water?

What about the FISH that died ? Did they deserve their deaths because they chose to incarnate in the water ? Oops. Let’s not go there.



With regard to the effects of the tsnumani, many more women and children died than men, due to the lifestyles they live and the subsequent places they would each be found in. Here are the after effects of the tsunami on women;
“In the worst affected village, Kuala Cangkoy, for every male who died, four females died — or in other words, 80 per cent of deaths were female. In the Borongon camp, just outside Banda Aceh, a room accommodates 21 widowers who have chosen to live together to cope with the responsibilities of CARING FOR THEIR SURVIVING CHILDREN.”
This is excerpted from http://www.oxfam.org.uk/what_we_do/issues/conflict_disasters/bn_tsunami_women.htm and the full article is worth reading. I suppose the RSE dogma answer is that the children and BABIES that died, chose only to live a short time so that is why they incarnated there. Always an excuse.

It seems many animals died after all:

"On India's remote Andaman and Nicobar islands.....
Island officials say at least 3,754 people were missing amid crumbled homes, downed trees and mounds of dead animals. V.V. Bhat, chief secretary of the islands, said the missing could not be presumed dead because they could have survived in coconut groves that dot the islands."

...and some Elephants survived:
"In the Thai resort of Phuket, five elephants, normally used to haul logs in forests, were being sent to pull heavy debris in areas that are too hilly or muddy for vehicles."

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20050101.w2tsun0101/BNStory/International

Also, from a website called compassionwithsoul (hello???) there were people
Who played a major part, post tsunami, collecting injured animals and helping them. It is a theory that animals MAY sense (some of them are designed to physically detect vibrations) the frequencies of tsunamis. However, that is not 100% and animals DID die in the after-Christmas tsunami, as well as others. Also, animals who survived may have died in the after effects by drinking the then-polluted and poison water. Humans know better than to drink such water. Why didn’t the animals ? Did those later poisoned and dead animals deserve their deaths because of their design ? Perhaps if you are only living from your third seal, you may view it that way. To say someone (human/animal) DESERVES their death, is a very strong statement. It is a FAR cry from explaining something in a mature, SENSITIVE, loving capacity. That is absolutely NOT the way in which that issue was presented at RSE. The tone of voice, and the words, clearly signaled a harsh, cold attitude. But, when you are red in the rainbow, how would YOU, current student, see it otherwise.


Current student; I do hope you are building your underground house and storing ten years worth of food, since you are clearly not a MASTER, and you appear to be on the wrong timeline to even need such things, much less a God-realized being. You ought to watch where you’re slinging your arrows, since we’re all connected because that means you’re just slinging it at yourself. When your heart opens beyond your own nose, the horizon changes.

Best wishes for your real enlightenment – freedom from RSE.

P.S. You are correct that you have no business posting here, so as the intro page says, your post is subject to dematerialization. Maybe that will be a runner for you !

hi watcha.please leave this post.it shows a ramthermindset so clearly that it is actually serving the purpouse of this webside.it showed so nicly why i am out of there initialy the behavier of people which are in total ramsterbrainwashmood is just???????????[no word pops up here]anyway

Watcha..

animals do have an instinct, more evolved then ordinary humans do have.
They (especially cats) "sense" for example earthquakes before they happen.
Of course.. a caged tiger will have to die.
Domestic animals have lost some senses partially.
In New Orleans were no hills to run..
Dogs are often dying together with the owner even if they know that they have to die.

Check out this link:
European Vegetarian and Animal News Agency

THIS link: http://www.evana.org/index.php?id=1726

io,

i never denied that animals have an instinct. i also don't deny that humans have an instinct, either.

my point was not that...but that animals, like humans are "fallible" for whatever reasons, (some of BOTH, DID die),and it is cruel (not to mention misleading) to say the least, for someone to state, especially in a public venue that such DESERVED to die.

Former Ramtha Student begins by saying, "I cannot restrain myself from commenting..."

Whoa...Has Former Ramtha Student missed the teaching of the emotional body? First order of business is to develop self restraint. Did Former Ramtha Student flunk out?

But of course not, I remember the sign hanging at the entrance to the arena,
"You cannot fail this school, you can only quit." RAMTHA

So what's up with Former Ramtha Student? No self restraint and plenty of attitude...

Watcha,

thanks for clarifying..
It is just that the animals still have those kind of "senses" ..even if not proved or understand scientifically.

But never mind!
I-know-that-you-know-that-I-know-that-we-know!
Just forget it and have fun!

Former Ramtha student needs to return to a Beginner Event and see if s/he can master the BASICS.

Cowboy, of course YOU're right about that sign hanging there that says, "You cannot fail this school, you can only quit." RAMTHA

How can that be a true statement, though, when some folks have been kicked out ?

Inquiring minds....

"What is wrong with you people? Didn't you get any of Ramtha's teachings?"

dude....i guess YOU don't get the point.
You are still assuming Ramtha's teachings are valid, whereas, we (or I) do not.
It is my opinion (and of verifiable research) that the teachings are totally plagiarized from other sources and can be found ANYWHERE.
Then they are copyrighted and spoon fed to
people like you who still buy it.

You still wreak of the naricissitic attitude than many Ramsters carry around with such authority.

A person starts a post with sincere intentions, and several months back, mind you, and trash the holy bejeezuz out of it.

Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

Hi Whacha,

I too think the post should be left. It is such a prime example of explaination without reason or basis.
For example the quote below:



"you can have compassion for the tsunami victims, but to realize they created their reality by choosing what they choose, you are giving them the freedom to live their journey, and are empowering them at the same time. If you see them as victims, you have taken their power away from them, just as you do to yourself. They created their reality because they chose a life where they didn't pay attention to collective consciousness – to the Isness, the Creator, the God within all things, to the quantum field – hell whatever you want to call it."

Several times FRSESTUDENT claims totally conflicting things and terms.

He/she says "...If you see them as victims, you have taken their power away from them."

But starts out by saying "...you can have compassion for the tsunami victims..."

He/she claims they created their own reality by choosing to do so and then in the same breath says that through compassion one can change their reality by giving them freedom and empowering them.

Total drivel!!!!!

JTR said, "He/she claims they created their own reality by choosing to do so and then in the same breath says that through compassion one can change their reality by giving them freedom and empowering them."

Exactly, JTR !
I would bet that 100% of the people who were old enough to say so and understand, who were warned of the oncoming tsunami in time to LIVE, would have gotten the heck out of there real fast had they been given the choice, the conscious physical life choice, TO STAY ALIVE, would have said YES, they want to live.

I can't imagine (unless someone had a death wish or some other issue along that line) that anyone would not have said they wanted to just hang out on the beach and drown in a few minutes when the tsnuami arrived.

Therefore, if I am correct, and it's fair to say that at least in SOME percentage of cases, it's going to be true that the people would have said they want to stay alive, why didn't they avoid death ? Could it be that Bad Things Can Happen to Good People, so to speak ? I say so. I wouldn't want that for anyone, but it seems to be just what happened in that case.

They did not deserve to die. They deserved for the almighty Ramtha to have saved them...that's MY reality. Where was he ? Hmmm.... could it be that he is non-existent ?

"the wisdom as the animals did"
How then does Judy's Ramtha explain 'roadkill'?
There are more animals lying dead on the roadways of the USA than people...??
as someone said: an inquiring mind wants to know...

I think that would be easy to explain. Animals are very sensitive to earth energies; but they wouldn't have the same sensitivity to a piece of machinery.

Bodi,

"I think that would be easy to explain."

Perhaps you may thinmk it would be easy to explain, but certainly not in the terms you mentioned....

"Animals are very sensitive to earth energies;"

I am assuming you are refering to energies changed by movement of the earth itself such as plate teutonics, seismic anomalies, changes in barometric pressure etc...

All of those things above would require an ability to sense energy transfered through the earth or atmosphere.

Ever put your ear to the ground by the train tracks and see if you could tell when a train was approaching?

Try going to the side of the road with a closet pole, rest it on the ground and see if you can hear the sound transfer from the earth.

Virtually all energy has transfer rates and measurable releases of energy.

Animals have the intuition to be careful on roads to a certain degree, they know it is dangerous for them simply from a behavioral point of view. Ie, they have either had close calls or witnessed some. Yet, they still do not seem to have the "wisdom" to keep from getting squished. SO, it does not seem to me that your explaination (while simple) is a probable one.

Hi,

there was one bear after hundreds of years in Germany..
his name was „Bruno“..
he striped a car on the „autobahn“ ..
just a small injury..
later he was shot dead..

He was not used to cross the „autobahn“ – a lot of „randomity“ there.
He did not learn in school how to cross a street.
If you put a Yelmie to Los Angeles or New York, he has more difficulties with traffic than those locals.
Different skills.

Does it mean that a Yelmie is less sensitive than a big-city-resident?

Simply put.. but wrong?

This premise that humanity is somewhat dumb and deficient is a common theme perpetuated at Judiths place,
much like the "Ramtha" statement "We use only 10% of our brains"

read ... faculty.washington.edu/chudler/tenper.html

That perticular "teaching" was pushed in the early years of RSEInc and ushered in the ‘Ramtha” brain science…
I have now realized that those endless hours of incomprehensible brain science was just another case of dumbing the folkies down..
To deride and ridicule the collective self-esteem and to offer the golden-God solution..
is all part Judith’s marketing strategy.
“dumbing down and building up” is exactly what charismatic cult leaders do…
Anybody that even remotely defends the statement that the “Tsunami victims deserved to die”
Is seriously mentally ill and a menace to society.

While pulling the petals from a flower..
the seeker was overheard saying..
God loves me yes?
God loves me no?


David

The responses to the original post are quite fascinating. IMO, hopefully without stirring up a dictionary war, a victim is someone to whom something happens to. We’re all victims – if not always, than at least one obvious time in our life. “Victim Consciousness” is when the ‘something’ that happened to us becomes the focus of our life, the defining framework through which decisions are made and actions structured. As Graced points out, to NOT be in victim consciousness requires the recognition and acknowledgment, the confession, of exactly what’s going on in the ‘something happening’, and the utter diversity of thoughts, feelings, and emotions resulting from it. To NOT be in victim consciousness is to recognize the patterns of behavior in ourselves and our life and be willing to no longer participate in the pattern. Judy is an excellent example/model of someone stuck in ‘victim consciousness’. Yes, she was sexually abused as a child. I have compassion for her. At the same time, where two or more women are gathered, at least one if not all of those women have been sexually abused to one degree or another -- --- having been abused may be a reason for Judy’s behavior, but it’s not an excuse – it doesn’t make it ok to therefore abuse others.
Thirty years of exposure to an all wise knowing intelligence enlightened ascended being, and the best of all metaphysical writings ever written, and Judy still functions through an alcoholic personality, still is motivated by an unfulfilled hunger for recognition power and money, is still lost in pain and anger and revenge – THAT’s ‘victim consciousness.

Thank you David for 'getting' my comment -- It was in response to Judy’s Ramtha teaching: “how the animals were a **** site smarter than the humans when it came to the tsunami”. She apparently saw the same newscast/newspapers as everyone else – with the same kind of not quite accurate information found in all of Judy’s presentations - as David pointed out above (as someone here pointed out – that lots of animals did die in the tsunami.) Of course there are countless stories of animals’ foresight, miraculous help to humans, and superior use of senses - as there are countless stories of Human Beings’ foresight, miraculous help to humans and animals. and superior use of senses -- that is not the point. And, of course in some dimension(s) somewhere it's all perfect and no body dies and we don't have bodies or we choose our bodies or we don’t and we’re all brilliant etc etc etc - – except we’re living in a 3 dimensional ‘space/time continuum’.- aptly described in creation stories, including Genesis - we live in a world of good and evil, up and down, big and little, duality - in which we are all saints and we are all sinners. No matter our superior knowledge – the only way out of this ‘reality’ is through the 4th dimension - but it requires opening the heart.

Judging by the amount of road kill, I would say that pretty well indicates that animals don't have the same sensitivity to machinery that they have to earth movement and other weather anomalies.

Thanks for posting, Nellie...excellent points that you made.

Why didn't Judy's Ramtha know and speak of these folks? Sea Gypsies Saw Signs In The Waves
Find out how the Moken people living on islands in the Andaman Sea in Southeast Asia knew how to save themselves from the deadly tsunami. Bob Simon reports. More...(story on 60 Minutes - June 10, '07 http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/60minutes)

Bhodi,

"Judging by the amount of road kill, I would say that pretty well indicates that animals don't have the same sensitivity to machinery that they have to earth movement and other weather anomalies."

Pretty well indicates??? How's that??? I would hazard a guess that the animals demise is more related to roads being obstructions to animal survival patterns, ie. water food shelter etc. then thier "sensitivity". It even may be that some animals are roadkill just because they dine on roadkill carcasses.

Nellie posted, "story on 60 Minutes"

Yes, I saw that, too ! I was going to post about it. Thanks for sharing.

Why didn't "Ramtha" know that ????